Well, I thought I had a good flooring contractor, until I asked him to write out what we agreed upon him doing verbally, in writing - on the work bid!

Was I wrong to ask for it in Writing?

Below is what I asked to have written on the work bid / contract, agreement after I was told it would only take 5 days to complete the job:

Repair ALL empty through utility holes in floors, replace one board in east bedroom with through hole near entryway, replace dry rot board('s) in west bedroom. Attempt to quiet floor squeaks in hallway, with some top nailing. Make oak - finished thresholds for wood to tile, and wood to vinyl transitions. Set up dust containment for Kitchen, laundry room, family room, bathroom, and north bedroom entries. All floors including the living room, hallway, 2 hallway closets, two bedrooms including closets to be sanded, filled, prepped, Natural stained, sealed with Glitsa True Seal, then top coated with two coats of Glitsa Max finish, (satin or possibly ultra satin). Post job clean up, and haul away all debris. Job is to take no more than 8 days to complete, or a deduction of $100 per day will be deducted from balance due each day job is not completed beyond the 8th day. (Unless agreed upon otherwise by Customer in writing).

I would also like some kind of wording on the bid about the guarantee we spoke about, such as:

-Company name- warrant the workmanship, and finish to be free of major defects for 1 year from job completion. (Major defects include finish separation, blisters forming in finish, excessive swirl marks, blemishes, or contaminates in the finish that are easily visible and create distraction (catch the eye) while viewing the area no less than 8 feet away. Warranty does Not include any customer caused issues, structural defects beyond the scope of re-finishing work, or pet stain discolorations that could not be fully sanded out).

The contractor took such offense to the above, he now has refused to do any work for me, and was majorly offended I did not just "take his word"!

Any thoughts?

What you ask for sounds reasonable to me.

I would not agree to a contract that had those types of penalties. A lot of the items are subject to interpretation and could be beyond the control of the contractor. I can understand where you are coming from but I can also understand why he walked away.

Not wrong in your opinion...but wrong in contractor's opinion. Try and look at it from his perspective. It kind of sets an adversarial tone to the situation e.g. penalties at the customer's discretion.

Thank You for the replies!

Please, can you help! Tell me what parts should be left out of what I wrote, that would allow it to be acceptable, or reasonable to ask my next contractor to write on the work order / contract bid???

Why is it wrong to ask for the work to be done, to be spelled out, and put in writing?

They want me to sign very vague bids, with NO particulars as to what they will do, besides "refinish 650 Sq Ft".

This region, is vary strange in my opinion. My first choice out of 5 contractors, refused to offer any warranty for his work. Even when I would email him questions, he would email me back, "call me and lets talk about it". IMHO that was so there would be no written response to any questions. He wanted $3250.00 to refinish my 650 sq ft., ($5 a sq ft), and when I asked him for a 6 month, or even 90 day guarantee against blisters, or de-lamination, or MAJOR flaws, he would simply side step the issue by saying look at my reviews, and my reputation in this area. When pressed he finally said, "well you can take issues up with the contractors board, or sue me if you felt you had to". But when I tried to corner him into saying he would come back, and make good on major defects, he would not agree to it, even verbally! He just said all wood floors have different character, and may finish out differently, sometimes not as you may want. Imperfections and some minor contaminates in the finish are to be expected. Again, I said in my desired workmanship warranty, "while viewing the area from no less than 8' away". I would think it would have to be a pretty big mistake to catch an eye 8' away!

Am I missing something? Is not $3250.00 worth some type of written guarantee against workmanship anymore? I am starting to think, just do the job myself, if no "pro" will warrant his work, and I am stuck living with Major flaws, short of suing them, I might as well be able to say "I did it myself"!

How would you word it, to make it acceptable.

Kind of have to agree with the contractor about wood having different character that may affect how it finishes. I get your points but some of them may make you appear to be a 'high maintenance' customer....what if the job takes more than 8 days for a situation that he feels is legit but you don't. There are some people who are very difficult or impossible to please and some of your contract provisions may raise warning flags. If you've had several bids and none will agree to accept the contract the way you want it written then you may end up doing the work yourself. If you want the work done via a standard contract then your best bet is to check references, look at some of their work, and trust in their professionalism and integrity.
Would you really want somebody working on your home who is doing so due to a time penalty? I tell them to take their time and do a good job.....but it's another story if it takes an unrealistic amount of time.

I still don't think that it is completely unreasonable. I would define terms a little more clearly and set comparative standards. Additionally, if I thought it would take 8 days, I would write 10 in the contract.
Understanding and fulfilling expectations of difficult clients can be very time consuming. A contract with clear delineations and expectations protects both the client and the professional.

That being said:

Being a wood floor mechanic is often more of an art than a science. Experience teaches us to take no floor for granted and no customer for granted, and so we learn caution, caution, and more caution. There are many subjective standards that affect whether the project will be a horror story or end "happily ever after." Sanding, sanding scratches, stain absorption, stain color, finish sheen, finish contamination, finish depth, and so many other variables affect the final product and ultimately, the final outcome.
I suggest asking the professional if you can go look at a few floors that he has recently completed. Don't just look at photographs. If you like the work, then you can discuss what type of contract he would like to submit for your signature.

Best of Luck!

In this coastal area, contractors very often "over book" themselves work, and are strung out between many multiple jobs, all at once. In previous experiences personally, and with hearing others horror stories, the time constraint in the contract becomes very needed around here. If they say, it WILL take "5 days, no way more than 7" and I start a potential repercussion fine beginning on day 9, it seems reasonable (to me). I would even say 10 days, and if the weather is the issue, for sure agree to waive it as that is not a scheduling fault. But I had a roofing contractor go 2 months beyond his scheduled completion date, due to working other jobs who were crying more the blues than me for completion. We will be living in our trailer during the floor refinishing, I would rather do the job myself and suffer the potential poorer quality, than leave it open ended to the known delay practices of so many contractors around here, regardless of their reviews, or history.

I guess I am just old school in that I expect professionals, to act as such, spell out a written contract of what will be done, when, and for what pay. I think more consumers should also require it, and quit being pushed around by "Pro's" unwilling to be and act professional. When I worked, I could never tell my boss what to do, (or when I did, he never listened). I mean, out of the 5 lisc. contractors I have had to my house, one was a "tweaker" and seemed strung out, another was for sure an alcoholic, one had only 2 jobs under his belt of experience, one would give absolutely no written or verbal warranty, and now this one, who refused to even discuss changing the wording I desired, to make it mutually agreeable. He just flat said, "I will not work for you now", for my offense of just asking we work out some wording to put on the "contract". IMHO, Its a sad state when we are all just suppose to just accept, "refinish 650 Square feet of flooring" on a "work contract".. Looks more n more like I will do the work myself if I can not find a real "Professional" to work with me, instead of just for himself! How did our world end up reversed like this??? Where the worker tells the paying employer, just what to do? (by the way, I was a union worker for 30 years - not in mgt.).

I guess I will take a positive approach and show the future flooring contractor my many VERY POSITIVE Yelp reviews on "professionals" that have done great jobs for me, and tell the flooring contractor I would like to do the same for them! Then, maybe, hint about spelling out in writing what will be done, and just skip the completion factor, or any warranty.. or NOT!

Why not just do it yourself? Is using prefinished flooring an option? If so, that will save you a lot of time. With the right tools it's not that hard to do.
Do it yourself and you'll be in full control and get exactly what you want. From your description of the contractors you have talked to most don't seem to be worth having do the work for you.
Where are you located?

Located in central, coastal CA. Half way between S.F., and L.A., its paradise.
After watching many you tube how to video's, i am very confident I could do all of the oak hard wood floor refinishing prep work. (Sanding, nail counter sink, filling holes, etc.) Yet, I also realize that the actual application of the finish, is something you can only learn by experience actually doing the job, making mistakes, and doing it right the next time. The finish, is probably the most crucial part, as it is what you will look at for years. For putting down the finish, I need a Professional, and will continue to search for one. There must be one out there somewhere, just have to find them.... Onto contractor # 6, 7, ???

If you can do all the prep work then take a shot at the finish. If you don't like it just sand it off and call in a pro. Applying poly is not hard to do. Get the right applicators and follow the directions.....and don't poly yourself into a corner.

I'd like to see the update on this thread, whether Beechnut finally hired someone, or decided to do it himself.

It used to be that two men could agree on a simple job and terms, shake hands on it and go forward. Depending on where you live, that might not be the case nowadays. At any rate, I don't see a problem with what Beechnut was expecting in terms of quality and job expectations. In fact, in a commercial construction contract, allowing for penalties for late completion, would be considered standard language. That said, I agree with JIMMIEM:



I would guess the clause for money penalties for a late completion was the main issue the contractor had a problem with. He likely saw it as potentially adversarial and took it as a 'red flag" for a difficult customer. He may have also been an old school guy and was personally insulted. However, nothing else I see in the contract terms should pose a problem for a confident and competent professional. In today's world, having things spelled out in writing protects both parties, if the terms aren't met on either side. Reasonable people can generally work things out but there are bad actors on both sides. Choose wisely.

Only my second post on this forum but I have over 20 years worth of manufacturing, commercial, and industrial contracting in the construction area to the tune of over 1 billion dollars.

You are 100% correct and within reason...ask the contractor to suggest terms that will work and if they will not RUN.