Amish made hardwood

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 Post subject: ?'s regarding new wood floor install in top floor Condo
PostPosted: Tue Dec 18, 2007 3:36 pm 
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I am planning to buy 1,000 sq ft of wood to install in my 3rd floor Condo.
I have 3/4" sub floors but have not seen the direction the joists lie.
I am getting 3/4" solid pre-finished wood. I was hoping for 5" wide planks but might have to settle for a smaller width due to cost ($5k shipped is my limit).

My questions are as follows:
1.) Is it alright to order from www.lumberliquidators.com?
I have heard many horror stories about bad wood and quality customer service from them.
2.) Is Bellawood a good wood flooring? I read a couple places on the net that there wood might splint or not hold up as well as other woods that aren’t as advertised.
3.) I was hoping to get a nice wood like:
http://www.lumberliquidators.com/catalo ... egoryId=60
Is there a comparable wood for around $4.50 a sq ft?
4.) What is a good and reliable place to order my wood from? Some local installers recommend I buy from Lowes or HomeDepot so I can return my left over unused wood.
5.) I plan to find out what direction my joist are and install at a 90' angle to the joists. I heard it minimizes noise from walking on it. What other things can I do to minimize the noise from walking on the floor?
6.) Should I install extra subfloor? I will have 3/4" wood. Should I install an additional 3/8" tongue and groove (t&g)
wood subfloor or a cork/other underlayment to reduce the amount of sound passed to the people living below me and stop squeaks while
walking on the floor.
7.) A local installer told me not to worry about moisture on my floor because heat rises and I don’t live on the first floor.
He said that if I install a vapor and water repellant, it might be a problem because if someone spills water
then when it soaks into the wood it will just sit between the water/vapor repellant and my wood and cause it to buckle.
I should not worry about water coming from under my floor because the chance of something causing vapor/water to come
through the subfloor are slime. Is this guy right or did I just catch him at a bad time (maybe he just finished smoking something)?

Statements to answer possible questions you guys might have:
1.) I will not be installing wood in the kitchen so I don’t need to worry about raising the floor and checking clearances of appliances (dish washer).
2.) I will be installing 3/4" pre-finished wood in my condo everywhere except the bathrooms, kitchen, and small 3' x 4' entrance (which will be marble).
3.) Both bathrooms and the Kitchen will be tiled. I will go and measure how much the difference will be in the wood flooring and kitchen/bathroom
tile floor. Hopefully the height difference is minimal. Otherwise I will have to figure out how to hand a big difference in height due to making
sure my wood is properly installed (subfloor, etc).
4.) I will check to see how the joists are lined up. If subfloor is needed I will install it at a 90 degree angle to the joists.

Thanks again in advance,
Oren


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Amish made hardwood

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 18, 2007 5:55 pm 
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1. I believe you answered the question your self. My experiences with them are that they do have cheap prices, but you get what you pay for, the floors are of lower quality (some/most)

2. I havent heard anything good about bella wood either

3. http://www.hardwoodinstaller.com/hardwo ... r/manu.htm this is a good place to start your search for wood. The bloodwood you are looking at from lumber liquidators, Last summer I installed that exact product (but 3 inch width) for my old boss @ his company, the milling was good, it fit togehter fairly well. But the finish was extremley poor quality. There were dimples/divits/scratches (under a few coats of finish) Bloodwood is a very hard wood, I had to pre drill anywhere a nail was going to go, the staple gun worked pretty well on it though. It is also VERY bad as far as breathing in the dust from cutting ect. Lots of bloody noses that week.

4. I wouldnt buy it from depot or lowes, they sell everything, but not the best of everything. Look for somewhere more into the wood flooring aspect, you will get a better product.

5. Definatley run it perpinduclar to the joists, this is necicary if you dont plan to add a substrate (more plywood) to the floor, there are many sound proofing products/methods available all over this site

6. This depends on what type of subfloor you have now, CDX OSB ect

7. I worry about moisture on every floor. 1st, 3rd, 37th be sure to let the wood acclimate in the rooms that it will be installed in for a few days, I prefer more on exotic species just to be safe. Use a product that the NWFA approves, and also what the hardwood manufacturer suggests, 15lb asphalt paper or hardwood fortified paper is usually the winner. Also use a moisture meter to check both the moisture of the subfloor and hardwood before installation. And I would keep that installer away from my floor

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Jay


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 18, 2007 6:19 pm 
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One other BIG issue is noise. You need to check with the homeowners assoc. regarding noise from floors. Many multiple storied buildings require noise and fire suppression underlayments. Your's may or may not. Do not fail to do this. It would big a huge mistake to lay new solid flooring only to find out you're being sued by the ho. assoc. because of failing to obey the noise and ordinances.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2007 2:00 pm 
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Thanks again for the replies so far.

Because of height differences with the kitchen and bathroom tiles, I will just lay the wood perpendicular to the subfloor. My only question is what 1/4" subfloor would be best for noise reduction?

My condo Association states I don’t need a specific underlayment, but must have 70% of the condo's wood covered (by carpet, tables, beds, etc).

Another problem I am encountering is that I search hardwoodinstaller and didn’t find any 3/4" solid real wood for ~$6 sq ft (I raised my amount I'll pay for the wood itself). Most of the stuff found was engineered and 3/8" or 5/16" in thickness.

If I went with engineered, wouldn't there be more possibility for noise due to the 3/8" thick plank squeak and causing more noise transfer to the people below verses a solid 3/4" wood?

What wood types are there in the $6.5 range that resembles a Brazilian cherry wood? As mentioned I checked the website above but most are engineered (not that engineered wood is bad or anything).

Thanks again in advance,
Oren


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2007 5:08 pm 
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You could glue down some cork underlayment with a quality urethane adhesive. Then glue down this floor:

http://www.hardwoodinstaller.com/hardwo ... ection.htm

using the same adhesive. This will give you a very good quality floor at a reasonable cost that will have a sound deadening underlayment below. A little more than your 6 bucks a ft. limit but worth it. Also, did you see this?

http://www.hardwoodinstaller.com/hardwo ... -solid.htm


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2007 10:43 pm 
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Gary wrote:
You could glue down some cork underlayment with a quality urethane adhesive. Then glue down this floor:

http://www.hardwoodinstaller.com/hardwo ... ection.htm

using the same adhesive. This will give you a very good quality floor at a reasonable cost that will have a sound deadening underlayment below. A little more than your 6 bucks a ft. limit but worth it. Also, did you see this?

http://www.hardwoodinstaller.com/hardwo ... -solid.htm


Thanks for the quick response. I have not seen those actually and they look nice. I have done some more think and will probably back track on my budget. I still have to tile the floors and walls of 2 bathrooms, and lat new granite countertop in the Kitchen.

I was thinking of one of these:
Mullican - Brazilian Cherry Natural Nature 5" (Yes I know its only 1/2" instead of 3/4")
Somerset - Mocha
Woodstock Hardwood - Exotic Teak

This is the 6mm cork underlayment I will lay.

I will swing by the iFloor store on Saturday and see these woods in person before I buy anything.

Thanks again in advance.


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2008 4:47 pm 
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An update to this thread.

I have a 3/4" OSB subfloor.
I bought 5" wide Mullican Pre-finished engineered Maple wood from iFloor. I also bought 5-Star Rated 6mm Cork Underlayment. I was told from a technical helper at Mullican to NOT staple the Mullican through the cork and into the subfloor because it would be like stapling a piece of paper to a leather couch and would never correctly adhere. He said to check if my cork underlayment supports the glue down method.

I was told that I should use Bostiks best To glue the cork to the subfloor and also the prefinished wood to the cork. I was also told if I want it could be cheaper to use Fastbond 30 or 40 to glue the cork to the subfloor. Can I use either or should I spend the money and just use Bostiks best for both gluing applications?

Thanks again in advance.


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2008 8:53 pm 
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Quote:
Can I use either or should I spend the money and just use Bostiks best for both gluing applications?

It is best to use the same quality adhesive for both the cork underlayment and the wood flooring installation. Never use an adhesive that has any water when gluing cork or solid wood. Bostik's Best is an industry leader but there are other acceptable alternatives from Franklin, Dri-Tac, Sika and others. I'd recommend a urethane adhesive that contains NO water, so acrylic urethanes are out.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2008 2:24 pm 
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Thanks Gary. I'll just buy a ton of Bostiks Best and use that on both sides. 1 more question I have is when installing the cork, should I have the cork curled up the walls on the edge of the room? When installing felt paper I see that it’s advisable to leave enough felt paper that you can have some come a couple inches up the wall on the edges. Is this advisable for cork?

Thanks again.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 11, 2008 1:58 pm 
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Quote:
When installing felt paper I see that it’s advisable to leave enough felt paper that you can have some come a couple inches up the wall on the edges. Is this advisable for cork?

No, don't bother. In your situation, it does not matter. You could put some cork in the gaps around the perimeter after you're done installing but it isn't required or needed, IMO.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 14, 2008 11:25 am 
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Thanks again Gary.

So to sum it up I will just put Bostiks Best on top of the current 3/4" osb subfloor, then place the cork on top of that, and then place Bostiks Best on top of that, and then place the Hardwood on top of that.

My last question is I what size coverage (trowel application) should I use to apply the Bostiks Best?

According to Bostik, I should use 1/4" x 1/8" Square Notch coverage (trowel application) between the hardwoord flooring and the cork. Should I use the same coverage (trowel application) between the cork and the subfloor or 3/16" x 5/32" V Notch coverage?

Thanks again.


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 16, 2008 12:39 pm 
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Follow Bostik's directions for the thickness of the flooring in regards to trowel size. If in doubt, call Bostik's. They will tell you exactly which trowel you should use for the flooring you are installing and the adhesive you are using.


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