Amish made hardwood

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 Post subject: Inspector comming tomorrow
PostPosted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 4:38 pm 
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Location: Newbedford
We have been doing this house in sections, With it all said in done will be about 3400sq', It's 4" prefinished maple been down maybe 6months, earliest installation has been 2 weeks. Only problem is it is cupping like you wouldn't believe. Someone is comming down to look at it from Summerset ( the brand of flooring), Also someone from Hoboken floors.
I know it's short notice but what happens at these things. The owner is expecting to get all her money back. I seen pics online and claims being denied. My boss is also expecting the company to do something. Guess time will tell.


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Amish made hardwood

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 9:31 pm 
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What was the moisture content of the wood at the time of installation? What was the moisture content of the subfloor at the time of installation?
What was the temperature and RH when the wood was delivered and at installation? If you don't have this documented you could be in for a hurting. The manufacturer is going to say its a exessive moisture problem, the distributor is going to say we distribute, and the customer is going to say give me my money back. Get an independent inspector. If the above readings were measured and everything lined up then the oenus is on the homeowner because you can't possible control future conditions in there house. If the conditions were not measured then it could be your fault.

Good Luck


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 11:16 pm 
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Tada is correct. Installers need to document the conditions of the house and the wood before they install it. I always moisture test. If a wood substrate is above 10 to 12% MC, that's a red flag in my neck of the woods. I also inspect crawl spaces and exteriors for moisture problems.

Here's what will happen. Somerset will provide a courtesy inspection but they will say what Tada said they would, excessive moisture. And they will be right! The wood wasn't cupped BEFORE you laid it so something on site is causing the wood to cup (aborb moisture). There will be finger pointing but in the end, the flooring installer is ultimately held responsible. Not for the excessive moisture but for installing wood flooring in an unacceptable environment. Your boss is probably gonna eat all that wood and labor and the homeowner will have to fix whatever it is that is causing the excessive moisture. Neither the distributor or the manufacturer will be held responsible.


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 20, 2006 6:48 pm 
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Well I didn't get to go to the inspection, and I don't know just yet what happened or the end result. My boss said he was worried that we might hang ourselves like if the inspector said "when was the last time your moisture meter was calibrated"? I can't answer the questions about the moisture reading because my boss took them.
What I didn't mention in my earlier post was that all we have left to install is about 80'( 2 closets), I think they were charged 5.25sq' for the wood plus another 2-3 dollars for the install, I'ts really to bad. It really was a nice house with 2 round rooms, coustom stair treads and noseings(semi circle). I'll post tomorrow when I know more.
Steve


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 11, 2006 7:40 pm 
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OK, Well the report said it was enviromental, and could of used more expansion, This was awhile ago. Anyway in the mail today, well yesterday we got a letter. basically we are getting sued and that we have 10 days to cut a check for 50,000, If not we will incure tripple damages, We can't contact them in any way shape or form. So I guess we will have to see what happens. We do have liability but It will be real interesting.
Steve


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 13, 2006 9:45 am 
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sdexcalibur wrote:
OK, Well the report said it was enviromental, and could of used more expansion, This was awhile ago. Anyway in the mail today, well yesterday we got a letter. basically we are getting sued and that we have 10 days to cut a check for 50,000, If not we will incure tripple damages, We can't contact them in any way shape or form. So I guess we will have to see what happens. We do have liability but It will be real interesting.
Steve


Under what legal theory would the damages be tripled?

I assume the $50K number is for costs incurred to lay the wood (and the cost of the wood itself) and then costs to remove. Basically to make the homeowner whole. Tripling of damages could only happen under very specific circumstances that would require them proving some type of gross negligence or intent.

I'm not convinced they would win that argument. But I suppose it is at least somewhat colorable, depending on the particular circumstances.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 13, 2006 11:24 am 
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Typical attorney babble. Contact your liability insurance carrier promptly to notify them of this legal action. Hopefully, they will pay to represent you. However, you should know that general liability insurance is NOT for performance failure and your carrier could deny your claim. In which case, you will need to retain an attorney who specializes in these types of actions. Don't assume anything. No matter how you look at it, this will not turn out well for you. Even if you win in court, you may not be able to collect attorney's fees for defending yourself. And courts often side with consumers, stating that the professionals should know better. If your liability insurance agrees to defend you, it will be a mark against you insurance wise and next time your insurance comes up for renewal, they may cancel you or increase your rates considerably. I hope things turn out ok. I could not take a hit like that. I'd have to declare bankruptcy.


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 13, 2006 1:11 pm 
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Thanx for sharing your perdicament. Makes me rethink a few procedures.

Keith


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Oct 13, 2006 3:44 pm 
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Quote:
"when was the last time your moisture meter was calibrated"?


this was interesting because i used to do calibrations years ago for QS9000 and ISO standards. if you contractors use any meters and never get them calibrated, this could be the single bullet that hurts the most. it's obvious they know that most likely no contractors ever get them calibrated and this could or would be their single biggest "out" that will fall back on the installer.

try going to court and answering that question. it only costs a few bucks to get them calibrated and have a dated, signed sticker attached to the meter by the company doing the calibrations. cheap insurance.


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