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 Post subject: Facenailing on center board of diagonal?
PostPosted: Tue Aug 22, 2006 8:53 am 
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Need some more advice from the masters. I am just about ready to start nailing my first boards today. I am doing a diagonal install with Ipe. I have installed the backerboard. When I put the first floor boards against the backer board, is it enough if I blind nail it or do I need to face nail it also all along the center? I believe I will need to face nail the corners atleast but not sure if I need to nail in between when I am already blind nailing?

Any advice on blind nailing? I guess I will need to counter sink it right? I have to go buy some decent counter sink bits.

Thanks a ton, as alwayz.


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 22, 2006 9:38 am 
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No need to face nail that first course (row), Simply start blind nailing. The backer boards will hold the boards straight. THen, when completed with that one half of the diagonal install, you remove the backer boards, install your spline (slip tongue) and blind nail through that. That will anchor down the backside of your first row and eliminate face nailing in the middle of the room.


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 22, 2006 12:06 pm 
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Gary wrote:
No need to face nail that first course (row), Simply start blind nailing. The backer boards will hold the boards straight. THen, when completed with that one half of the diagonal install, you remove the backer boards, install your spline (slip tongue) and blind nail through that. That will anchor down the backside of your first row and eliminate face nailing in the middle of the room.


Excellent. Thanks.

Sorry to bother you again. By blind nailing, does it mean, I use the pneumatic nailer, right? Some friend just mentioned blind nailing by drilling a hole and hammering a #8 nail for the starter row. I am hoping that it is just using the nailer/stapler to do the blind nailing? Thanks.


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 22, 2006 7:32 pm 
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Some friend just mentioned blind nailing by drilling a hole and hammering a #8 nail for the starter row.

That's for when you are starting next to a wall. The floor nailing machines don't work right next to walls. There isn't room for them. That's why those areas need to be done by hand or with a finish nailer. But if you are starting in the middle, use your nailing machine. Don't beat the first two or three courses (rows) too hard; just enough to set the fasteners. You don't want to knock things out of alignment. Make sure you backer boards are straight and well attached. Screws work good for those.


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 22, 2006 8:50 pm 
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I did the first row just now. My IPE install is going extremely bad. First I found out that the backer boards moved even though it was screwed using 2 1/2 inch wood screw to the subfloor. The backer boards are pine (1 1/2 in width). Also, the tongues have split. I ran the full first course along the center and I was ecstatic and then when I placed the 2nd row, I find that the tongue is not going into the groove at all fully. Then, I found that lot of the boards have the tongue split. I had my compressor set around 75-80 psi. I did see that the staples are sitting quite perfectly but the wood is breaking. How can I fix this, o floor masters. I am in a fix right now. I really appreciate your help and excellent advice. Thanks a ton.


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 22, 2006 11:59 pm 
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IPE is an extremely difficult wood to nail down. You will need to experiment with a few techniques before going any further. First, don't nail too close to the ends. Stay back from each end about 3". Then, do not nail too close. No more than 12" apart. One fastener about every twelve inches. Next, try to change the angle at which the faster penetrates the wood by placing a strip or two of masking tape on the front of the nailing machine shoe. And experiment with the compressor PSI. If you're running at 75 to 80, try going higher, like 90. If that helps, great. If not, go higher still or back way down to 70 PSI. You're trying to find that sweet spot. One other thing that may help is to soak the staples in oil first. Something like olive oil. Between all this, hopefully, something will help prevent tongue breakage. If not, you may need to try a cleat nailer, which supposedly will reduce tongue breakage. It is OK to have tongue split occasionally but not to the point where it sacrafices integrity of the floor.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 23, 2006 12:36 am 
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Oil the ends of your staples with 3in1. It works. I would shy away from vegatable oils. They will never evaporate.

Just out of curiosity, are you doing this on a 45 or are you actually striking a line fom A to C? I prefer the latter. It really makes for a more attractive floor. There is no rational reason to choose an arbitrary angle like 45. Why not 57 or 39?


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 23, 2006 1:35 am 
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There is no rational reason to choose an arbitrary angle like 45. Why not 57 or 39?

A man after my own heart! I often wondered why it had to 45 degress. I've seen floors laid at unusual angles and it is really rather appealing. You can tell when it's 45 degrees. But if it's 33 or 61 or whatever, it really is unique and actually draws attention to the floor more because it is not in line with anything in the structure. I think I'm going to do it in a bedroom in my house just for the hell of it. Lay it at 36 degrees. Yeh, that's it. That's the ticket!


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 23, 2006 1:38 am 
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Oil the ends of your staples with 3in1. It works.

I wondered if those types of oils would interfere with any of the finishing products so I hesitated to recommend them. However, if ya think they are better, I'm taking your word for it. :)


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 23, 2006 8:04 am 
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Gary wrote:
Quote:
Oil the ends of your staples with 3in1. It works.

I wondered if those types of oils would interfere with any of the finishing products so I hesitated to recommend them. However, if ya think they are better, I'm taking your word for it. :)


I have done exactly as you recommended except for changiing the PSI and the oil. I will try both today. Mine is a 2 feet strip flooring. So, I am stapling 5" from the corner and kinda 12" apart so that I am getting 2 staples in there. I was so happy that the stapling was so good until I saw the splits. I will try lowering the PSI and also the oil. Thanks for the tip, guyz.

Also, I have a chalk line at exacly 45'. I am taking it all the way from my family room to living room. I am not able to take a diagonal from one cornet of living room to the other corner of the family room. it is not aligned. So, I thought I would just do a 45.

Thanks for your advice, guyz. You are my savior. I will try it tonite and let you know.


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 24, 2006 9:36 pm 
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thallikar wrote:
Gary wrote:
Quote:
Oil the ends of your staples with 3in1. It works.

I wondered if those types of oils would interfere with any of the finishing products so I hesitated to recommend them. However, if ya think they are better, I'm taking your word for it. :)


I have done exactly as you recommended except for changiing the PSI and the oil. I will try both today. Mine is a 2 feet strip flooring. So, I am stapling 5" from the corner and kinda 12" apart so that I am getting 2 staples in there. I was so happy that the stapling was so good until I saw the splits. I will try lowering the PSI and also the oil. Thanks for the tip, guyz.

Also, I have a chalk line at exacly 45'. I am taking it all the way from my family room to living room. I am not able to take a diagonal from one cornet of living room to the other corner of the family room. it is not aligned. So, I thought I would just do a 45.

Thanks for your advice, guyz. You are my savior. I will try it tonite and let you know.


Found the sweet spot. 60 psi is perfect for Ipe. But I found that I have to hit it correctly, too much force cracks the tongue and too little keeps the staple out. I am getting there. I am making 1 mistake ever 15 planks. Hopefully, I will get it perfected tommorrow.

Mine is a 24" strip flooring. Are 2 staples enough? Each at 6" from the ends. That would make it 12" apart. Thanks, o flooring gods.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Aug 25, 2006 10:41 am 
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Mine is a 24" strip flooring. Are 2 staples enough? Each at 6" from the ends. That would make it 12" apart.

It would be best to staple about 3" in from each end and once in the middle. Try that.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Aug 25, 2006 10:53 am 
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Gary wrote:
Quote:
Mine is a 24" strip flooring. Are 2 staples enough? Each at 6" from the ends. That would make it 12" apart.

It would be best to staple about 3" in from each end and once in the middle. Try that.


Thanks. I will try that.


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