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 Post subject: Engineered Wood Floor - Cupping
PostPosted: Mon Jan 10, 2005 5:30 pm 
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Have had a Harris Tarrket Longstrip engineered Floor in my kitchen for about 12 years. Floor also extendeds through the hall and to the entryway, for a total of about 560 sq ft. About a year or so after we constructed the house (1992), an area of about 30 sq ft cupped pretty badly.

This installation was done by a carpenter freind of mine and was a glue down. We followed the recomedation for the glue down, including recommended adhesives by Harris Tarrket. This is a glue down over 3/4 inch OSB subflooring.

Unhappy with the floor, I contacted the manufacturers rep. The reps initial accusation was that the dishwasher had leaked at some time. Well I knew this wasnt the case and I argued my point. The damage was several boards away from the dishwasher and seemed to substantiate my clame of "no dishwasher leak" The rep went down into the cralwspace, with his camera and his meters, and came to the conclusion that he could not find any evidence of any water damage by the dishwasher or the kitchen sink at any time. It was the manufacturers reps determination that the damage was caused by one faulty package of the Harris Tarkett flooring. They agreed to compensate me for the floor and also gave me two new packages of the same flooring in order to make the repair.

The damaged area has not gotten any worse nor has any new area of the 560 sq ft become cupped. I would like to try make the repair without damaging the undamaged portion of the floor. The floor still looks great with the exeption of the 30 sq ft or so of cupped floor.

Does anyone have suggestions for this type of repair? Anyone with experience in this area? I am not opposed to pulling up the whole floor if the repair doesn't work out, however I would like to see if I could make the patch fix work out first. Its going to be a big job no matter what I do, as the center island will have to come out in order to make the repair. It will be 4-5 times the job if I have to repace the whole floor.

Should I ever want to sell my house, I am afraid I will be dealing with this issue, either because of lack of buyer, or of house inspectors wanting the floor repaired. In any event, I want to get rid of the problem and do not want to live with it, walk on it, or look at it anymore. I would appreciatte any input or idea's on doing this type repair.

Thanks
Terry


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jan 10, 2005 6:01 pm 
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Glued to plywood? That can be difficult to repair. Chances are good you may pull up chunks of the subfloor along with the damaged planks. Color match may also be another issue. Replacing the planks can be done-- it's just a matter of patience and somebody that knows what they're doing.

For your sake, maybe the carpenter friend didn't use a lot of adhesive which would make removal easier.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 10, 2005 6:05 pm 
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Hi Ken and thanks for the quick reply. Would you recomend saw cuts spaced close together, or taking the damaged material out with a router?

Terry


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 10, 2005 6:27 pm 
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The link below should give you some ideas, but it's more on the lines of repairing a floating floor...I should finish that section someday :roll:

http://www.hardwoodinstaller.com/hardwo ... -floor.htm


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 11, 2005 1:40 am 
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If the cupped area hasn't gotten worse, you maybe better off having the floor resanded and refinished. Since it's 12 yrs. old, I'm sure it's about time anyway. Trying to patch a longstrip floor that has been glued down to plywood will be very difficult, as Ken has mentioned. Not only that, the new material wil not match a 12 yr. old floor and you'll probably have to resand to match anyway. Since your on a wood subfloor, you could nail down any loose areas as well. If it was my call, that is the way I would approach it.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 11, 2005 1:48 am 
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Hi Gary,

Thanks for the input. I took a block of wood, just messing around and I placed it over the cupped area's, and it actually went down a lot when I tapped it. Its still a little cupped but the high ridges are gone. I don't know how long it will stay that way but I think it might be livable. That would be nice if it stayed in place anyway. Has anyone ever tried anything like that before with long term results???

If it will stay like that, I think I will take your advice with some finish nails and try the screen and coat procedure listed on Hardwood Installers webpage.

Thanks
Tery


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Jan 11, 2005 6:49 am 
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Sounds like delamination of the top layer of veneer.

How ar you going to screen a cupped floor???

The surface has to be flat for screening to accomplish anything.


Basic Coatings has TyKote, which is a sandless system.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 11, 2005 12:03 pm 
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Perry is wright. It seems odd that the stuff would stay cupped. I suppose the stuff must have been laminated with woods of disparate MC.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Jan 11, 2005 1:33 pm 
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Thanks Perry for the info about TyKote. I will definately look into that. I really hadn't thought abuot how I would sand a cupped floor. I believe you are right about the delamination causing the cupping. There is one peice in particular where abut 4 inch's or so, the laminated strip was entirely protruding above the floor. It clearly was delamination there. Thank goodness for me its located up under the toeboard of a cabinet and not very noticeable. My wife had never noticed it till I pointed it out to her, so that was a good sign. All of my probs seem to be limited to about a 20 sq ft area, or about the area 1 box of flooring would cover.

Is there anything else I should be thinking about that I could do as far as correcting the edge delamination. I read something about hypos and glue. Do you think I would have any chance with something like that as far as a more permanent fix than tapping down the edges. If so, any suggestions on the procedure and adhesives I would want to use?

Thanks Again
Terry


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Jan 11, 2005 2:01 pm 
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Thanks Chuck for the post.

Yesterday when I started this post, I hadn't a clue about what the problem might really have been caused from or how I would deal with the problem at hand.

My eyes have now opened to the very good probability that my cupping problem is one stemming from delamination of the top layer.

I am going to take Perry's advice about the non sanding method as it make a whole lot of sense. Any suggestions on how to go from here before I get to the TyKote stage are appreciatted? I will be doing some checking on Tycote today, though I probably won't get around to any refinishing for several weeks.

I am just starting to do a upgrade/remodel in the kitchen so one big question for me was, what am I going to do about the floor before I spend a bunch of money on new appliance's, lighting and granite countertops. The existing cabinets are going to stay, so it would be good news if I didn't have to pull them out to replace flooring. At a bare minimum, the island would have to come out to do any floor repacement and then there is the color match problem. Definatley, it might be easier, faster, and a better outcome to approach a repair of the existing, if it can be done that way.

Thanks Again
Terry


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