What dustless systems have any of you used/own/like?

I am going to avoid posting prices as all the ones I have seen are all in the same general area (for the portable ones) As those are the ones I am interested in, I use astro vans, not full size and I get all my tools in them perfectly including they DCS.

I ask because 2.5 years ago I bought the bona 110 DCS, It was almost double the price as it is today.

Shortly after first using it, one of the motors went out, So I would only be able tou use one tool with it at a time (that was usually ok, but when I first got it I could run the edger and machine with almost no dust.) When the motor went out I could use either the machine or edger with no dust, If I used both dust woud pump out of the edger base because of poor suction.

The place I bought it from wouldnt let me take it to a site and try it out, nor will they let me do so with my next one (4 different distributors) I can try it at thier warehouse, but they all feel similar there. I could rent it, but it is not inexpensive.

So I have sold my bona one, and now my choices are the Clark (I forget the model, But its the black one that looks like a torpedo) It is an all in one unit that looks like a vacume, and it connects to everything via the hoses. (edger Buffer, Hummel etc.) same way as my bona did, wich basically means duct taping the hoses to the tube one the hummel (It works better than the accordian tubing adapter they offer.
My second option is the Oneida OCS, it is almost the same price ( a little more) It looks a little cheaper, and more home made.... But I think that its because they spent more time making it work better, versus making it look better.
The system works differently then the bona and clark. It has a large can for the dust collection, But you use your own vacum, they sell one with it also. Instead of running just a hose to your tools, there is a cyclone attachment for the edger, and one for the hummel. It replaces the pipe that the bag for the edger attaches to, the whole unit. And for the hummel, it replaces the shaft.

So I have narrowed it down to those 3 choices I think, So I ask have/do any of you use either of these? Or another one that works better?

The 3rd choice is to get another Bona 110 DCS, they realized that the motors were messed up after my warranty was expired, and since have put better motors in them, but I am not sure that its worth the risk..


and after typing all of that I realized this is the internet, and I could just post links.

Oneida
http://www.oneidavac.com/systems/ovs_ind_add_vac.htm
Clark
http://www.hardwood-floor-sanders.com/details.asp?EquipID=cav26
Bona
http://www.fcimag.com/CDA/Archives/1197b873501d8010VgnVCM100000f932a8c0____

Thanks in advance, and sorry for the long post. I just dont want another experience like I had with the bona.[/url]

Jay,

I cannot say which DCS system is best. I just got a new Clarke buffer and vacuum for myself and only used it on one job. It's just for the buffer and edger, not my Hummel. I'll still be using a bag for that. Many say the Oneida system works great but my issue is those cyclone collectors on the machines themselves. They look delicate and for me, would be in the way. I chose Clarke equipment because they are the world's largest manufacturer of floor care products/equipment. They offer a satisfaction warranty, a two year warranty and my local distributor beat the best internet price I could find. My distributor is great and a Clarke dealer. If I have a problem with anything, they typically take care of me. Another system that you could look at as well is sold by Latta, called the Ruwac Eliminator. One gent in Canada says he has great success with it.
http://www.lattaequipment.com/products/ ... %5FSeries/

Servicing is important when buying eguipment. If something goes wrong and you cannot get it serviced locally, that would be a deal breaker for me.

Gary

thanks, I realize the attachment on the edger may be a problem, But the idea of the attacment on the hummel makes me happy. I can use the edger at thier warehouse to see how it would affect it.
The filter on it is fairly inexpensive to replace (about equal to a few of the internal bags that the bona had, clarke too?)

I have a great deal of trust in the clarke brand, thier edgers and buffers speak for themselves. Thier belt/drum sanders leave a little to be desired IMO, but no one company can dominate the market.

Repairs are a big concern, seeing as my bona spent more time in, than it did for actual use, 2 years of it being check out only to see it was one of the 2 motors was shot (after any warranty claim could be made) Later I find out that they knew the motors in the first few batches were bad, but had so many orders and pre orders that they just shipped them out and hopped for the best.

I think the 2 main points for me, are the hummel attachment, and the fact that if the vac part/motor etc goes out, you can use your own vac as a replacement etc.

I will definatley look into the one you posted, I just want to make the right descion on this as now more and more jobs are going dustless, and I dont like the dust myself, and miss my broken bona

I hear you. It is a tough decision. Those are expensive pieces of equipment and it's a major investment. Here's a thougt. I don't know if you've heard of Bill Price's Floormaster's website but it's pretty much devoted to us finish in place guys. Both Floorguy and Jerry post on install issues because those are discussed as well but a lot of finish in place issues are brought up and discussed. Dust collection has always been a big topic with lots of opinions. If you signed up there, you could search the topics and read what guys all over the country have to say about which systems they use and how they like them. Here's the link:
http://www.floormasters.com/community/viewforum.php?f=1

Thanks, I had poked around on there before. and what do you know the first page has a DSC thread

There is a company here, that has 4 full time crews. Believe it or not, they use the cheap Harbor Freight dust collector. The keep it outside, and it does pull some dust. I saw it for myself, and the thing only cost $170 and another $30 in hoses & reduction adapters.

After Googling it, it seems like it's a decent unit, particularly for the price and after some tweaking.

See that comment scares me, While all dustless systems still have dust the closer to dustless the better. The price is great, and would love to spend a few hundred on it, vs thousands. But on a daily basis I remind my customers that they get what they pay for When they get some of these extremley low estimates from other companies. So to me It only makes sense to listen to my own advice.

The CFM rating on the unit is 168, The clark is double that if not more. I forget what the bona was but it was in the same area of the clark. I cant seem to find what the rating is on the oniedia though. I will have to keep searching.

They are $199 now.











Creates a Dust-free Atmosphere
Powerful 2 HP dust collector creates a dust free working environment. Develops over ten times the suction of most shop vacuums. Works with a 4'' hose to pick up large chips from jointers, saws, shapers and planers. Hose sold separately.

* Locking casters
* Lockable on/off toggle switch
* Motor: 2 HP, 110V, 14 amps, single phase
* Bag capacity: 70 gal.
* Air flow: 1600 CFM
* Single stage
* Filtration: 30 micron
* Hose inlet: 4''
* Overall dimensions: 75-1/2''H x 33''L x 22''W
* Shipping weight: 145 lbs.
* CSA-US certified

I swear the site I was looking at said 160, maybe I need glasses
And Im gonna guess they keep it outside because of the cloth like bags? nice and dusty, like my hummel bag.

but 200 bucks..... I think I may just pick one up just on price alone, Looks like I will be resanding my house again to test this.

Does the "big machine" really need to have a vacuum hooked up to it? The only time I notice any dust coming from it is when I go too long without empting the bag.....which of course I rarely do. Otherwise just about every belt or drum sander I've ever used has been able to pick up their own dust with just the suction from their own motor.

I did use bona's horse trailer vacuum on a handful of jobs and was never really comfortable dragging the vacuum hose while walking the belt sander. It was cumbersome and annoying. Plus it would be hard to find parking for the trailer on some of my downtown jobs.
I also wondered how things would go when winter came around since a door or window must remain open for the hoses.......brrrrrrr, chilly!

You do need a vacuum system to control the dust from the edger and the buffer though. I use two ProSand SuperVacs (the fat, round, blue ones) and I can run two edgers with a vac for each edger. I could use the Y splitter and hook up two edgers to one vac, but it does not suck up the dust as well. Besides if you have two vacs you can split up without dragging miles of hose. Or somebody else can be cleaning while you're buffing .

IMO there are just more pros to having a smaller more portable DCS.

Sorry Bona horse trailer.

speaking of floormasters anyone kno whats going on with that site

completley agree on the portable system. My budget wouldnt allow for the trailer system (although a vacum with a motorcycle engine is tempting)

I have the small clarke/alto vac like Gary has that I bought as a package with a the 1600 buffer...thing is incredibly quiet!..works great for the edger or buffer

Greetings,
I bought a "Dust Deputy" from Oneida about 18 months ago. Oneida claimed it separates 99.5% of the dust. I dont think this is accurate - I'd say it is closer to 99.8%

I am extremely.....thrifty....yah, that's me. I just got the cyclone section. It is only 12" tall but I think I could park my pickup on it without denting it. Maybe not. It is very thick, welded steel.

Being a , eh, THRIFTY do-it-myselfer I installed it on a 5 gallon bucket, hooked up a shop-vac to it and vacuumed up a bunch of FINE buffer dust, the stuff like flour, almost flows like liquid. It allowed only a tiny amount thru to the vac, and some of that may have been in the hose already.

I researched cyclones a bunch, and decided, hmmm, it lets so little thru, and a cyclone is more efficient when the velocity is increased, let's experiment with NO FILTER ON THE VAC. It worked. You could SMELL the wood dust, but not see it.

I completed that job with NO filter in the vac.

I dont recommend this as a regular practice. It may have been the extremely low humidity of that cold winter day that helped, as the unit built up a significant static charge which would have improved the separation. (I'd have to get into the physics of triboelectric effect, which is another thread...)

Anyway, my point is, LOOK FOR A UNIT THAT INCLUDES A CYCLONE.

I have tried Oneida's system at a demonstration. It works fascinatingly well and it is fun to watch the dust stream thru the clear cyclone.

Yah, It is not cheap, but none of them are. And you dont need a MOBILE HOME to keep it in. Instead of a traditional vac motor or blower, it uses a "regenerative blower", also know as "ring compressor" "vortex blower" or "side-channel blower". (Not sure why so many names, but it is used as a blower, compressor or vacuum, so take your pick.) This thing is a marvel. If you get one, look inside...looks sorta like a jet turbine. Very nice machining.

If nothing else, you save on filter costs. Since so little gets TO the filter they need cleaning MUCH less often. This also means they maintain capacity much longer as they are not getting clogged.

One point I'd like to make is that a LARGE cyclone does not mean it separates more dust. A small unit is more efficient as, for a given blower/vacuum motor, the velocity will be greater.

Gnarlywood