I have a chance to get a Classic 8 at a real deal, but I don't know if that is what I want to start off with. I figured I should learn with a drum sander.
I have run the machine and feel comfortable walking it up and back a room.

I don't feel any chatter. Should I buy it? I want a Hummel,but I also want a Trio and I also want a new edger and......................................

Not to take anything away from Ken's fine board he has here, but have you asked this question over here.
http://floormasters.com/wwwboard/wwwboard.html

It is the sand and finish Message Board.
Those guys know there stuff.
I think Gary posts over there, too.


From what I have read over there, hold out for the Hummel.

I read that site,but most of it is over my head. Besides you will get 50 different answers to a question.

Chuck,

That Classic 8 is pretty old technology. The Lagler "Hummel" was the first of it's design and is still considered by many to be best in it's class. I own and use a Hummel. There are tricks to using one. When I brought mine in for a "tune-up", I asked the tech which brand and machine was the best, in his opinion, he responded that the Hummel was the best. A Classic 8 can do a fine job and the paper is less cost than belts. If you learn how to load the paper properly, you will reduce your chances of chater. The big differences between the two, besides one using belts and one using a split drum, is in dust extraction, durability and user comfort. The Hummel is superior in dust pick up and my machine is 14 yrs. old and I've never needed to replace the bearings (you know what they say about German bearings). Here is a used one for sale.
http://www.flooring-classifieds.com/cgi ... =retrieval

Good Luck!

The classic 8 is a belt sander.

My apologies! I thought you were refering to an older Clark/American 8" drum sander like this.
http://www.goldenstateflooring.com/tool ... merican812
This is the only newer Clark belt style sander I was aware of.
http://www.hardwood-floor-sanders.com/d ... oorcrafter
Perhaps the model you are refering to is no longer made or has been renamed the floorcrafter. Peace, Gary

I did a google and it cam up with a website that had sanding belts for it. But I did not find the sander or who makes it.

Maybe so. Thanks.

I also like the Bona DCS machine. I can get one of those for 3grand like new.

So Chuck,when you say the DCS machine, exactly what are you refering to? The Bona DCS (Dust Control System) includes a buffer, edger, vacuum and their hoses and attachments. http://www.goldenstateflooring.com/tool ... /0/bonadcs Doesn't include their floor sander as that continues to use a bag. Perhaps the seller of the set-up your looking at is including the Bona Pro Sand belt sander

You don't have to buy them all. It is PRO SAND equipment.

My dad uses the DCS big machine and the DCS buffer. He uses a bag on the big machine and hooks everything else to a collector. The buffer is great when used with a back vac. I was using it today in a an upstairs hall. Very nice.Very clean.

I have heard good things about the big pro-sand vac. They say it pulls harder than the dual motor deal.

I think his method is kind of sloppy. He has more cords than hoses,so he does not have them tied together. I am going to bore a hole in the top of my clarke 16 buffer instaed of buying a new machine. Then all I will need is a skirt and some hose.(that sounded bright)

I want to hook all of my equipment to a vacuum. I figure I just need to pig-tail my edger and my buffer and then affix hoses to the cords with wire ties. Then I can just put my booster and my collecttor in the same place. That way it will be no different than dealing with a cord.(sort of)

I like the Atomic system,but that is not a start-up kit. Not for me,anyway.

What do you think,Gary? How much cfm does it take to pull for a big machine?

I didn't answer you question,Gary. My apologies. heehee I was referring to the pro sand belt sander with the electronic motor . There is soooo much stuff out there I would like to have. Then again,I know guys who make pretty work with an old drum sander.

I really think the key is knowing your equipment. Every machine is different. The Bona/Pro Sand machine I was referring to was probably used by a guy who didn't know how to use it. I looked at it and the belts were kinked. The guy probably left them tight and then never figured out why the machine would not run smooth. Who knows what else he did, though.

I have come to believe that cutting the floor with the big machine is probably the easiest part. After drum tension is right,it is pretty much like walking back and forth.

Sanding floors with the big machine is a matter of walking back and forth. It is also a matter of knowing your woods, how they sand, floor types and how to sand those, which grit to use in which circumstance, proper direction of sanding and sequences, sanding new vs refinish, etc. A pro makes it look so easy. And it can be, until you you across a difficult job. Or you screw up your first sanding job and are trying to figure out what you did wrong. The ProSand gear looks great. I had a chance to run it breifly at an NWFA class about five years ago. The sander was new and worked fine. I don't know about it's durability. If I were to get one, I'd opt for the 10" model over the 8". I still hold that the Lagler "Hummel" is the most durable as it's design is rather simple and easy to use. It doesn't have a bunch of unnecessary features to go wrong and fail. It uses simple solutions instead of complex to address the functions of the machine. That, along with German quality, make it so long lasting. Go to a large drum and sander repair shop and look which sanders are in there. You'll see mostly American, Clark, Alto (all the same now), Pro Sand, Galaxy, Harvester on the east coast, Kunzle and Tasin, Silverline, etc. Rarely see a Hummel except for a tune-up. The motors and bearings just don't wear out. Hummels are not the easiest sanders to achieve excellent results with. They are the most durable and are great for one man ops because of the ease of moving them (compared to some others). But get what you like. The ProSand gear looked a little delicate to me.

My father has three big machines. A clarke 8,a clarke 10 and the pro sand super 10. I have not used his clarke 10.

The pro sand machine is really nice. It runs really smooth but it is hard for me to manipulate. It has a sort of mortorcycle throttel deal with the handle to feather. The problem for me has been the other feature which lets you roll your wrists forward to increase drum pressure. I have had trouble with it. I wind up doing it by accident.

I'm already uptight running the machine. That feature is a bit too complex for my untrained self. My dad loves it ,but he told be the machine was difficult to run compared to a Clarke. He has been doing it for a long time,though.


He tells me that if he were going to buy a new machine,it would be a Hummel.

Thanks,
CHU

Listen to your dad. "Father knows best"!

Tax returns (If you get one) are coming ... hold out for the Hummel.

Pro for the Classic ... a little heavier, good for first cuts and knocking off old finish, cheaper to repair since a US product.

Con ... Not as easy to transport as hummel nor as well built or as 'comfortable' to operate (in my opinion) and you may be glad that repairs are cheaper cause you may find out more frequently with the classic than the hummel.

Pro for Hummel ... Extremely fast break down if you work alone. I can assemble and disassemble for transport blindfolded. NEVER needs tuning unless your just wreckless. Leaves barely any sign of a ridge on ends to edge out (maybe from lighter weight or better feathering with the lever???)
Bag sits squarely on machine (if you run it like the picture shows) and that helps to have a totally unobstructed view of the floor on both sides of the machine (helpfull in cut up tight floor plans) so there is no fooling around with swinging your bag from one side to the other and if you let her get too full the weight of the bag won't cause the machine to cut a little heavier on that side..

One diff. from most big machines you MUST run hummel from left to right of room because of offset wheel path.

Con for Hummel ... A liitle light for roughing off old finishes. Gotta walk a bit slower to compensate and helps tremendously to make first cuts at a 15 degree angle. If ever any vaccuum challenges it is very difficult to get into the machine for repairs (but they next to never break down) Upper assembly seems to get pretty banged up when cutting on old waxed red fir floors. First cutting dust is sticky, gets behind paper, sticks to the roller (upper tensioner), roller getts pitted, crap builds up on it, paper explodes, not fun. However, I don't know if the classic has the same challenge on that type of floor? Could have just been a bad day for me. Now I keep the old upper roller for those kinds of jobs and have a new one on now.

Anyway ... I hope my ramblings help too.
All the Best,
William
Heritage Hardwood Floors
Coeur 'd Alene, Id