I'm building a new home and hired a floor company of 55 years to install 846 square feet of 5" wide quarter-sawn white oak.

I have no idea about wood floors - I selected to company based on an installation I liked in a $1M home and the 55 years of business.

The floor was installed in February this year. About 3 weeks after the installation, two slats in the floor buckled like this: ___/\___ . Shortly after that a couple more spots buckled. I called the floor company and was told that the buckling is normal and the wood is acclimating to the new environment. It would be corrected during sanding and staining phase.

Yesterday the floor company was to come out and finish the floor (sand, scrape, and stain). The installer arrived and, when seeing the buckled slats, called the owner of the company to come out. The owner declared that the floor was water damaged, but he can repair the sections of buckled slats and everything would be fine.

PICTURE #1
PICTURE #2
PICTURE #3
PICTURE #4

After the owner left, the installer (who is employed, not contracted, by the floor company) told us our floor will never be correct and could not be repaired unless the subfloor was replaced. They recommended we only allow the floor to be removed and replaced.

Can some of your please offer your opinions on the best option for everyone is? I don't want to 'over demand' anything - I just want what is fair. A moisture reading taken by an independent company measured 18 to 19% on the subfloor and 10-12 for the hardwood.

Lastly, here is what was laid:

Layer of mastic (sp?)
Layer of felt
Layer of mastic (sp?)
1/2" Plywood
Layer of felt
1/2" thick 5" wide Quarter Sawn White Oak Slats

Any help or advice or glaring problems pointed out will be greatly appreciated.

Thank you,
Dan

Let me guess???


This is a solid wood, over concrete!!! New construction and new concrete slab.



It would be totally torn out of my house and done right!!! Anything else is just a band-aid

Your subfloor should be at about 10% New concrete needs about 90 days to cure and then should be moisture tested before installing. Your contractor did not test and your floor will see much more movement. It all needs to be torn out and the slab allowed to dry.

If your Flooring contractor has 55 yrs of experience, it surely doesn't show. His "vapor" barrier system is flawed, and using only 1/2" plywood for nailing is inadequate. Not only that, but I agree with my other comrades in arms, that the slab is too green. Plank floors are to be within 2% MC of the subfloor. Unfortunately for you and the flooring contractor, Marco and Perry are right, it will all need to be removed and done properly. The slab needs to cure completely, a moisture barrier installed, then at least 5/8 ply (3/4" preferred) before your quartersawn planks can be successfully installed. Also, all wet trades need to be completed (tile, plumbing, paint, etc.) and the HVAC on and operating at normal temps BEFORE the flooring can even be delivered. THen it should acclimate in the temp controlled home for a week minimum. MC of the flooring and subfloor should be checked prior to install and be within 2% of each other. This floor will continue to have problems years down the road and will never perform normally without complete removal and reinstallation.

.....

I was afraid you were going to say that (all of you)

Thank you all for your professional opinions.

the moisture barrier is not perfect, but still holds back enough to slow the emissions from concrete. The reaction to moisture was too fast, in my opinion, to be a concrete problem.................. ALONE. For moisture vapor to travel through two layers of mastic, two or three layers of felt then into the wood without seeing more damage to the plywood indicates a lack of material acclimation and lack of building acclimation. What wet trades were in the house after nailing the wood down? Is the building under acclimation?
However,,,,,,,,,,,, Sub-floor moisture of 18% and 19%??? Maybe too high for concrete moisture alone.. those numbers are up there with water intrusion.
I think the numbers and the appearance of the wood suggest there is more to this failure than just "excessive concrete vapor emissions"...
My humble opinion...
And your installer is correct.. this is not repairable.

I want to learn how you made that symbol and posted the photos.
THank you.
Ray[/url]

__/\__

never mind, I figured that one out.
Now the photos.

Latest update: Well, with advice of counsel I have to give the floor company an opportunity to repair the floor. The floor company has agreed to repair the floor at no charge. They intend to shave the slats that buckled and lay them flat.

Now, if the floor finishes out nicely and looks great, then it seems to me that everything is kosher. I know the floor is not right, but again, if it all looks nice, then I'm happy. We will insist on a 5 year warranty.

If the floor looks bad or I find other problems in the floor related to the floor buckling after the repairs have been made, then I will continue to push the matter for full replacement. On that note, what do you floor experts suggest I look foor during the repair and / or after the repairs have been made?

Thank you,
Dan

Dan:
I know and respect everything these professional installers on this site are telling you. I believe they've spoken their piece.
Sounds like your hired company did it wrong and you're settling for a "band-aid" solution to a major hemorrhaging.
By nature, quarter-sawn oak's tendency is NOT to warp. However, you have such a major problem that the boards in the picture are cupped already. Great forces are at work here!!
Listen to Ray and the others. Copy these posts and show them to your "counsel".
Just my opinion. (Far be it for me to tell someone else what to do! he,he)
Charlie Benghauser

Hey, Ray! Nice website. Why didn't you put your picture on it?

I think the problem lies in acclimation. The wood was acclimated on the floor or there was no heat/air on during, or prior, to installation.

For one thing, neither mastic, felt or plywood are vapor barriers. This is where so many installers get into trouble. They are relying on what "someone" told them instead of measuring the floors with meters and tests. Had a calcium cloride test been performed, that would have been an indicator of what was needed to be done to control moisture. The company could have used any of the vapor barrier systems that are effective instead of relying on asphalt felt. Also, Ray could very well be correct that the flooring was acclimated improperly. Since the installers didn't take moisture meter readings, there is no way to tell. Also, it almost looks like they missed nailing those boards that are peaked. I'm not saying they did. It just looks that way.

Gary:
Just a side question: Lately (since I moved to Arizona) there's so much work here that people are calling me to install as well as finish. I'm an expert in finishing, but I have alot to learn about installation I have the NWFA Manual, I have a feel for wood, and I am able to think(duh!). Anyhow, I enjoy thinking a project through and customizing a recipe for success with the customer.
Question is: When measuring the moisture of a slab, can moisture meters (which kind/brands?) replace a calcium chloride test?
Thanks in advance.
Charlie

I use my Tramex Moisture Encounter, as an indicator, by mapping the entire slab. I can find 'hot spots" that might be of concern or that a CC test is needed to be sure.