Hi folks:

My husband and I installed a bamboo hardwood floor in our house throughout the whole house, excluding all bathrooms. We live in Florida, and within a few months of real rainy season, we noticed that several areas lifted and black mold appeared underneath. These areas were around the periphery of the house and near doors/windows. That's one problem - even in our baby's room, in her closet it is black and mold is growing underneath. Her room is right next to a bathroom and where the washer/dryer is hooked up.

Then, another section in the middle of the living room is coming up buckling, no where near the periphery of the house. We are having to walk over it and our 2 year old is tripping on it - need to fix that...

Third, there is one section that used to be a garage that was converted to under air. That whole area buckeled and we removed all the wood. Right now there is just concret underneath. The guys who installed it came out to take that part out and did moisture readings. In the same section, there are two different moisture readings, 3.5 and 5.5%.

Finally, there is a sunroom in the back that was also an addition prior to us moving in. It is right next to an outdoor pool. That section was so back buckling and moldy, we removed all the wood in there.

We will try to work with the installer on these issues, but does anyone have some advice on how to present this to them? They thought we had a water problem near the doors / windows are were right on that. I think we may need to replace some windows/doors to get a proper seal. But what about the stuff happening in the middle of the floor?

Any help would be appreciated. We are very disappointed as the installers were recommended from our friends and we feel they did not install correctly or use proper preparation prior to installing the floor. I asked them about the need for a moisture barrier, and he dismissed it saying that if there was water anywhere, it would penetrate the moisture barrier so we should not bother.

Thanks.

Lisa, Boca Raton, FL

I hope the installers have deep pockets!


No moisture tests were taken before the installation started.

You concrete has a high moisture vapor emissions.

The garage buckled because it has no moisture barrier under the concrete, what so ever. Garages rarely have poly under the concrete pour. Now the rest is high, but not as high as the garage.

If the slab is 3-lb or above, you will see what your seeing. An Anti-microbal adhesive should have been used, along with a moisture blocker.


Remove all the bamboo. Let the slab surface air out with a closed up home and the A/C running. Test the slab again for moisture vapor emissions and apply moisture block, prior to the reinstallation.

This is not your fault, and don't let them tell you it is. This cost should be the installers cost, for not installing to industry standards, and taking moisture readings of the concrete, then not using preventative measures to keep it from happening.

I hope your installer has deep pockets.

Haven't heard that one before. I see it referenced with the Anderson Duck glue. Care to elaborate? Aside of what Perry mentions what kind of adhesive was used? Home/slab elevated? Any drainage problems? Does water sit on the side of the house after rain storms?

Two major issues causing cupping with bamboo, that I see often, are:

1. Lack of acclimation of material to "in use" conditions and

2. Concrete Moisture.
However, this sounds like water intrusion is part of the problem. water from exterior?
Ray

Floorguy,

Could you elaborate on a "moisture blocker" product that can be used in a glue-down installation?

I was told that one cannot seal the concrete in a glue down installation because the glue will no longer adhere to the concrete.

I'm about to glue down 5/8 hardwood flooring purchased from Floor & Decor here in Jacksonville Florida. I did the clear plastic tape-down moisture test and it came up clear, but am still somewhat nervous about the longevity of the wood in Florida's humid climate.


Any additional elaborations you can provide would be much appreciated.


Regards,
Tom

It is a system, developed by the adhesive manufacturers.

Here is Taylor adhesives LockDown
http://www.wftaylor.com/newlock.php

Bostik adhesives has a system with their VP moisture block

Franklin adhesives has one too.

Ardex has one too, that has an excellent warranty.

Hi folks,

Thanks to all who replied. Here is more information on our situation.

There were multiple floor surfaces in the house when we purchased it...wood, laminate and tile. After removing all old flooring, moisture tests were done and only one area was really high, our dining room which used to be a patio and there are old sliding glass doors boardering the sides of this room. Somehow or another, we found a crack in the outside and put some kind of sealant (a handyman said that was what had to be done - we used silicone, I think). Then, all rooms checked out ok and we did the whole house in bamboo with glue.

The glue that was used was called "STAUF - Solva-Mastic WFR-90" I think. I asked about putting a moisture barrier down several times, and installer (who is a subcontractor for HOme Depot, Lowes, etc. but did this job on his own with his partners), said not necessary. He said if there is water, it will come in anyway and the barrier really does no good.

One of you asked is the slab raised and I would say yes, you walk into the house and you step up several inches, just like most houses. The biggest problem is there were several "additions" in the house to create more square feet under air. The now dining room was a patio and has sliders boardering one wall. Rain and water is collecting in the bottom of the doors and we are now seeing the floor raising with black mold underneath. Similarly, one room used to be a garage and is now level with the house and under air. That room buckled so bad we took all the wood out and all you see is concrete and some vestiges of glue there. The moisture test showed a line dividing two readings - one at 3%, the other at 5%. This had the installer puzzled.

Our baby's room boarders a bathroom and washer/dryer and looks like water is getting into her closet and again we see black mold under the wood there.

Our sunroom is an addition also, and the floor is even with the house, but that room completely buckled and moisture so bad we took all the wood out.

Our master bedroom is where there are more sliders boardering one wall, and again, water accumulates and we are seeing floor raising up and black mold underneath. Also, under the window box in there, the wall seemed a bit wet and thus, floor got wet and buckled and black also.

One more piece of information: This house has no rain gutters, so water and drainage may be a problem.

Now, what to do from here? Each room has it's own challenges. Plus, don't know if the concrete just has excess moisture. A friend of mine who is an engineer came over and looked at the floor (he prepares floors of commercial buildings) and said he noticed the floor is not level like he would have expected.

We spent $20K on materials and installation, and don't know where to go from here. The installers came back once after I bugged them multiple times and when they came back, they showed us we had a water intrusion problem that needed to be fixed before we can fix the floor. HOwever, since then, the middle of the floor which is no where near the perimeter is buckling! We feel we made a huge mistake installing wood in Florida - we are 1/2 mile from the ocean. Don't know if that makes a difference.

Someone suggested we get two dehumidifiers for our house, would that help?

Any ideas on what to do and how to proceed would help. I feel we have to fix the water intrusion problem near the doors, windows, but what is happening in the middle of the floor? Who can help determine this? How do you get under the house to see if the slab has too much moisture? Why wouldn't this have come up in the original moisture readings?

Most of the damage happened after we had monsoon rain storms over the summer followed by four consecutive hurricanes. We made a claim with our homeowners and it was outright denyed. Can't even get them to get us a copy of the engineer's report.

Help?

Thanks. Lisa (Original Poster)

Concrete can actually act as a sponge, if ground moisture is super saturated.

If the soil around your home is not 3" below the top of the slab, it is considered a below grade installation.

All water needs to move away from the concrete foundation. Even a sprinkler system that sprays on the slab, can cause havoc.

If too much water is added to the concrete, as sometimes happens while they line up waiting to pour, the concrete will have bigger capillarie, once dry. Which means it will move moisture faster. Sucking it in, and letting it go.

That was wierd, it kept redirecting me.

*.*

Most of the problems after heavy rains and hurricanes? This is a major clue...
The flooring can buckle 20 feet away from the moisture source as water moves and seeks the lowest level. Sure sounds like a major change or water intrusion is the root cause. These cement block walls accept water that moves into the home along the perimeter walls. This may, or may not, be concrete moisture related. Loss of power for an extended time in high humidity weather can also cause an increase in moisture content in the material causing buckling and cupping. No matter the cause, you have a flooring failure and it sounds like you are being held responsible for the failure. SOrry for your problem.. An inspection may only prove that the weather caused the failure...
Ray Darrah

Had you and your installer chosen a floating floor with the proper polyethylene vapor barrier, you may not have had such a problem. Since the poly vapor barrier is supposed to be drapped up the walls to the tops of the baseboards (or thereabouts), the floor could have survived TEMPORARY vapor intrusion. Since it sounds like you also have water leaks (plumbing and doors), no wood floor could be expected to not be effected. The installer was wrong about vapor barriers not working. Had an effort been made to have one installed, your situation may not be so grim. But what to do. Rip all the bamboo out and clean the slab by abrading/sanding/grinding. Outside, have gutters, downspouts and drain pipe installed to carry the water off. Improve lot drainage as needed by regrading and installing drain pipe and catch basins. Inspect all doors and windows for leaks. Either repair or replace doors and windows that are not weather tight. Have a roof inspection for leaks in the roof system and flashing. Once you have watertight house, you can concentrate on the interior. Have all plumbing inspected for leaks. Repair as needed. Have all water using appliances checked for leaks. Repair or replace any moldy surfaces. You may need to hire an expert for this as your families health is on the line. Once your home is mold free and watertight, then you can look a floor choices. If you have storm damage insurance, then file a claim. All they can do is say no. And then you can get an attorney. Your situation sounds awful.

Sorry for all the problems, but if I were you, I would find a reputable inspector, and have him, or her, give you an independent assement of your situation, and what steps you might take. Clicking on Ray's link would be an excellent place to start .
I do not know if the installers you hired are licensed contractor's , or if that is even required in Florida. I hope you have some legal recourse. This could be a very expensive lesson. Good Luck

Ya, call or e-mail Ray! He's in Florida, somewhere. LOL

He is one hell of an inspector. He can find the problem.
It may be worth it, in the long run.

This consumer did call me. Thank you for the referral.
In conversing with this consumer, it was learned the installer placed the flooring over a converted patio and garage concrete sub-floor. She also stated she had water intrusion through the exterior doors.
Any experienced installer would know not to install wood based or grass based products on patio and concrete sub-floors... you would think.